Living Clean with Dr. Alejandro Junger

Dr. Drew Sinatra: CLEAN. It can mean a lot of different things to a lot of us. It can mean an absence of toxins, but it can also be about removing toxins already in our bodies.

Dr. Steve Sinatra: Today, we’re joined by prominent cardiologist and New York Times bestselling author, Dr. Alejandro Junger, to talk about his CLEAN program.

Dr. Drew Sinatra: Dr. Junger believes that CLEAN isn’t just a product or diet, but it’s a whole experience. A way to feel good every single day.

Dr. Steve Sinatra: Detoxification is also something doctors must focus on to truly heal their patients.

Narrator: Welcome to Be HEALTHistic, the podcast that’s more than just health and wellness information — it’s here to help you explore your options across traditional and natural medicine, so that you can make informed decisions for you and your family. This podcast illuminates the whole story about holistic health by providing access to the expertise of Drs. Steve and Drew Sinatra, who together have decades of integrative health experience. Be HEALTHistic is powered by our friends at Healthy Directions. Now, let’s join our hosts.

Dr. Drew Sinatra: Hi folks…if you like what you hear today, and you want to listen to future conversations on all things integrative and holistic health, subscribe to our podcast at BeHEALTHisticPodcast.com. Also, check out and subscribe to the Healthy Directions YouTube channel, which features video versions of our episodes, plus extra videos you won’t want to miss. And finally, we have more with me, Dr. Drew Sinatra, my dad, Dr. Steve Sinatra, and other health experts HealthyDirections.com.

Dr. Drew Sinatra: Welcome, everyone, to another episode of Be HEALTHistic. CLEAN is a leading health and wellness company built around the 21-day CLEAN program, developed by cardiologist and New York Times bestselling author, Dr. Alejandro Junger. For over 10 years, CLEAN has prided itself on being the go-to resource for anyone who wants to experience what feeling good really means. CLEAN sits at the intersection of Eastern and Western medical practices, utilizing elements of functional medicine, Ayurveda, and powerful nutrition, combined with coaching, to create a total network of support.

Dr. Drew Sinatra: Dr. Junger believes that CLEAN is not just a product or a program, it’s an experience. The philosophy of the program is that it’s possible to feel good every day, which involves learning how our individual bodies work and how best to fuel them. Well, Dr. Junger, welcome to the show.

Dr. Alejandro Junger: Thank you for having me.

Dr. Drew Sinatra: Now, I would love it if you could explain and talk to our listeners about your journey from becoming a conventional cardiologist into doing what you’re doing today, with Ayurveda and functional medicine.

Dr. Alejandro Junger: It’s a long story, but I’ll try to make it short. I grew up in Uruguay, where at the time that I was growing up, there were no supermarkets, everything was very natural. And I was very healthy by default, my mom would spend the day cooking for us. And when she finished having lunch, she started cooking dinner — and life was simple and natural. And then when I graduated from medical school and moved to New York to do my internship, residency and fellowship at NYU Downtown Hospital and then Lenox Hill Hospital, I started getting sick. Initially, I started gaining weight, I started having difficulty digesting. I started having seasonal allergies that, over the years, turned into around the clock. And the most problematic symptom that I was experiencing was depression. So I was a third year cardiology fellow and at some point, I really had difficulty functioning. So, I decided to take a couple of days off and see the top gastroenterologist, allergist and psychiatrist at the hospital where I was training.

Dr. Alejandro Junger: And after a full day of consultations, I ended up with three diagnoses: severe allergies, severe irritable bowel syndrome, and severe depression — and I was given seven prescription medications. And when I arrived home that night and just looking at the prescription medications, I had this really intense, gut feeling that this is not what I wanted. And then I had this big “a-ha” moment that this is the exact type of medicine I was practicing for my patients — a pill for an ill. And being discontent with that plan, I started looking for a different solution. I didn’t know really where to look, I had only been trained in Western, allopathic, modern medicine. So I decided to go to the bookstores and look for information on the most worrying symptom that I was having, which was the depression. And I was experiencing a lot of negative, repetitive thoughts that I didn’t know how they were appearing in my mind, because I wasn’t really deciding to think that. If I had a choice at the time, I would have decided not to think 99% of the thoughts that were appearing in my mind.

Dr. Alejandro Junger: And those thoughts were playing my emotions like a guitar. So, looking for an explanation of where these automatic thoughts were coming from, I started looking in the psychiatry books. I couldn’t find any reference to this phenomena that later on, I realized was common to 99.999% of the population. Some have more negative, repetitive thoughts, some have more positive, repetitive thoughts, some have completely positive, repetitive thoughts — but they’re just repetitive thoughts. And in one way or another, they’re exhausting. So, not finding anything on the psychiatry libraries, I started looking in the self-help and eventually in the Eastern philosophy sections, where I found a book about meditation. In which meditation was explained as the practice that eventually will allow me to slow down and even shut off this broken radio in my head. So I started looking for a meditation teacher and I didn’t find one.

Dr. Alejandro Junger: When I finished my fellowship, I had all these offers to work in these very prestigious medical practices, but I just didn’t want to, and I wanted to really address the problem of my depression. Eventually, I found a meditation teacher with whom I had a very strong experience, ended up in her meditation school in India, an ashram, a monastery of sorts, and spent a year and a half there really dedicating myself to meditation practices. But my exchange to go and learn that was to offer my services as a doctor. So I was taking care of the clinic at this ashram, where there were a lot of people from all over the world. And we would see people together with other practitioners. There were Chinese medicine doctors, Ayurvedic medicine doctors, naturopaths, chiropractors, hands-on healers, Reiki masters…you name it. And we used to sit in a circle with the patient, and everybody would ask questions according to their training, and then everybody would suggest a path of action therapy according to their understanding.

Dr. Alejandro Junger: And without even knowing the term integrative medicine, that’s exactly what we were doing. And I really, really liked that because everybody had different aspects of health that they contributed to, and people will get really, really well sooner, and better, and cheaper than with regular medicine. And my mind was just cracked open. On return to the United States, I decided I’m going to do exactly this — I’m going to find all these practitioners and going to have a community of healthcare practitioners that we can participate together in the care of people. But I was confronted with the harsh reality that in order to be hired by any cardiology practice, I had to be very profitable. And in order to be profitable, that translated to about seven minutes per patient.

Dr. Alejandro Junger: So patients would come in, the nurses would do their intake. And there were 10 rooms that the nurses kept on filling, and I would walk from one room to another after they had their blood pressure and their temperature measured, and their chart. So the patient would think that they spent an hour in the medical office, but really, with me, it was seven minutes. And all I could do was defensive medicine. And I call it defensive medicine, this idea that I was infected with during my training years — that anytime you do anything for a patient, anytime you write a progress note, you have to imagine that you are in court, and the judge and the jury are listening to what you wrote. And so, you have to cover your bases, right? This was how I was trained. This was very unfulfilling to me.

Dr. Alejandro Junger: And I would end up just prescribing a bunch of pills, get on to the other room, prescribe a bunch of pills, get on to the other room, and do the same thing, all day long. And then I would have rounds in the hospital, where I would eat, again, from the hospital cafeteria. The symptoms that I was suffering from, which had improved somewhat in India, through their vegetarian food cooked with love, and the meditation, and some advice that I got from the other practitioners. They all came back with a vengeance. So there I found myself again, working in hospitals, sick, depressed and unfulfilled. At that time was when a friend of mine came to my house in Palm Springs. I opened the door, I just couldn’t believe what I was seeing because it was a different person. His eyes were white and bright, his skin was clear and shining. He had this glow, and he had lost 15 pounds.

Dr. Alejandro Junger: Now, I had seen this guy 10 days before, and he was his usual bloated, inflamed, all reddish in the skin, 15 pounds heavier. So I just couldn’t understand. This didn’t make sense to me, according to what I knew at that time. And I said, “Dude, did you have plastic surgery?” He said, “No. I went to a detox center.” I said, “I didn’t know you were into drugs.” And he said, “No, not that kind of detox.” I said, “Well, what are the kinds of detox exists?” And he said, “Well, come, let me show you.” And 10 minutes away from my house at the time in Palm Springs was a detox center called the We Care Spa, where they do juice fasting and colonics, and a bunch of supplements — all foreign to me at that time.

Dr. Alejandro Junger: But when I arrived there, the owner being Argentinian and speaking my language — I’m from Uruguay — I started seeing all these people that were all shining, they were all glowing. The longer they had been there, the higher the intensity of their glow. And then I started talking to them, and they started telling me, “I had rheumatoid arthritis and I’m better, and I come here every year and follow the instructions at home,” and “I had diabetes and it’s reversed,” and “I had heart disease and it’s reversed,” and “Cancer and I should have died five years ago.” I was just blown away. Then I had the conversation with the owner and creator of this place, who herself had gone through heavy health issues, and through chiropractors and other practitioners had learned the basic concepts and practices of detoxification and had opened this place organically through the years, which became worldwide famous. There’s a waiting list to be able to get there.

Dr. Alejandro Junger: And she said to me, “Well, those symptoms that you suffering from, I can help you get rid of them like that.” So I decided to try the program, and within 10 days, the results were: I was looking, feeling 10 years younger, no symptoms whatsoever of depression, irritable bowel syndrome, or any allergies at all. I felt better than I had felt in a decade. And I just couldn’t believe it, it just blew my mind. And I was wondering, how come I didn’t learn this in medical school — because it all seemed a little hokey-pokey. So I became obsessed with understanding what went on, and what was going on in all these peoples’ bodies. So, talking to this lady who was not a doctor, she started giving me books that were a little…not the type of books that I was used to, referring to proven scientific concept.

Dr. Alejandro Junger: They were Arnold Ehret’s The Mucusless Diet, and Rise and Shine, and all these type of books, right, that were really interesting and made a lot of sense — but I just could not connect the physiology with what they were saying. Until I found the Institute for Functional Medicine, and when I took their first course, the AFMCP, Applying Functional Medicine in Clinical Practice, was where I had this huge revelation. And I understood that I had been taught in medical school how the kidney functions, I had been taught how the liver functions, and the intestine functions — all in separate classes.

Dr. Alejandro Junger: In fact, many of my friends became either liver specialists, or kidney specialists, or digestive specialists, right? But none of us were taught how to understand that all these organs, apart from other things, are contributing to a system of detoxification. So I finally understood what I experienced myself, my friends, and everybody that I had seen. And I became, really, a student of functional medicine, and started really understanding the programs that I was putting people on, because I started doing that, and the rest is history. That changed my practice, that changed the course of my life, really. And then I wrote a book about it, which became a huge success. It’s translated to 30 languages, New York Times bestseller, and from then on.

Dr. Steve Sinatra: Yeah, Alejandro, that’s a really heart-felt story. And I completely resonate with you. I mean, 20, 21 years ago, I did the Vasant Lad training, the Panchakarma in New Mexico. I don’t know if you’re familiar with Vasant Lad.

Dr. Alejandro Junger: Yes.

Dr. Steve Sinatra: But it was amazing. It was around the time I was studying for the American College of Nutrition and I took their exam for their CNS, a certified nutrition specialist. And the Panchakarma was great, it was incredible. It was only a one-week program, but I really resonated with what you said. And then, have you heard of Sanoviv in Mexico? Have you heard of their program?

Dr. Alejandro Junger: Yes, yes. I almost became part of their board of directors.

Dr. Steve Sinatra: Yeah, I went down there myself and worked with them, and I gave some lectures down there, and I sort of bonded with him. And I had a great experience with Sanoviv, as well. So I think detoxification is so important and you said it so brilliantly — mainstream medicine doesn’t deal with it. And you were suffering for years until you realized, through all the areas you went to and in your search, you found the answers in detoxification. And I know my son Drew, as a naturopath, he deals with detoxification on a daily basis. So for our listeners, this conversation is extraordinarily important because as you said it so clearly, if you don’t bring detoxification to the table, you’re going to get sick. Because everybody’s toxic in the present world we live in, irrespective of COVID-19. We’re all toxic and we need to detoxify.

Dr. Alejandro Junger: Even before the toxic world that we created. Thousands of years ago, huge and important systems of medicine like Chinese medicine, Ayurvedic medicine, are based on the principle concept that health and disease start with the accumulation — or not — of toxicity. Right? So detoxification is so important. In Ayurvedic medicine, toxicity is given a name, Ama, and it isn’t distinguished between the body, the mind, and the emotions, toxicity. It’s all under the same umbrella, right? Ayurvedic medicine has been around for thousands of years, even before the great toxicity that we are polluting the planet with, right? So this is important, regardless of the toxicity of the planet, but with it even more.

Dr. Drew Sinatra: Yeah. And another piece of what you shared, Alejandro, that makes this so important is that you went through this on your own. You experienced the glowing of your face, your skin, right? The shining that you mentioned that you see in the patients that go there. And since you’ve been through that, you’ve understood what it’s like to go from feeling depressed, having IBS, feeling terrible, fatigued in your body…and then feeling amazing. And I think that piece that you’re able to experience yourself and then share through all your books, and the way you lecture, that’s beautiful right there. I’m so happy that you’ve been able to experience that and share it with everyone.

Dr. Alejandro Junger: I have so much respect for naturopaths these days, right? Because through the years, and especially after being exposed to Ayurvedic medicine. Because in the beginning, on my trip in the ashram the first time, I saw what they did, but I didn’t really understand it. I didn’t pay much attention, even though I witnessed the great benefits from applying its knowledge. But later on, after I learned functional medicine, years later, I went to India and I sat down with one of the Ayurvedic legends in India, Dr. Narendra Singh, who’s no longer with us, but I was lucky enough to catch him at the end of his life, and sit with him for weeks, just seeing patients. And what I learned is that the main problem that humans have these days is that we have departed from the ways of nature. Now that manifests as the toxicity of our planet, but it manifests in many other ways.

Dr. Alejandro Junger: For example: breakfast, lunch, and dinner. This is not the way that nature designed us. If you look around and see every other species of animal on the planet, doesn’t have breakfast, lunch, and dinner. And this is something that we don’t question. So most animals in the wild, or in the conditions in which nature designed them to live, eating and living in the way that nature designed them to live, do not get as sick or sick at all with the chronic diseases humans are suffering from. And why? Because they are respecting the laws of nature. We have departed from them and we’re paying the price.

Dr. Steve Sinatra: That’s very well said, and one of the things that I really enjoyed in your book, Alejandro, in your CLEAN 7 here, is that — I thought page 17 was brilliant. I mean, you literally captured, in two pages and summarized the toxicity in the workplace, in the diet, in the home, in pharmaceutical meds. It was absolutely brilliant, I couldn’t have done it better myself. And as I was reading it, I was saying, “Oh my gosh. This guy has really got it.” You know what I mean? So I just wanted to give you that feedback…that was an awesome read for me.

Dr. Alejandro Junger: Thank you for that. And just to give the listeners an idea of what you’re talking about — I describe in the book, from the moment that you wake up from a mattress that may have been off-gassing fire retardants, and being cozy in your sheets that you washed with detergents that contain SLS and other chemicals, then you put your feet on the floor, which usually if it’s carpeted has off-gassing of the adhesives that the carpet are stuck with, or the woods that are treated with all these chemicals, including mercury and lead. Then you go to your bathroom, and you either take a shower or you wash your face with water that has all kinds of chemicals from what it collects through the old lead pipes or copper pipes, to whatever comes in the city-supplied water, which you find medications, chemotherapy agents, antidepressants. And apart from all the other pollutants that we are exposed to.

Dr. Alejandro Junger: And then, you brush your teeth with toothpaste that contains not only fluoride in excess, but also the reason it foams is the same reason that your laundry detergent foams — because it has a chemical that makes it foam, right? And this is something that you’re washing your teeth with. Then you put deodorant with aluminum and all kinds of things. Then you go for breakfast, and that’s another attack of chemicals between all the things that we consume as foods. But they really are just edible products, right? All the coloring agents, smelling agents, texturizing agents, pesticides, insecticides, preservatives, conservatives. So by the time you leave your house, you’re exposed to a minimum of 2000 chemicals that alone or in combination are known to cause hormonal disruption, cancers, inflammation…you name it, right? So we are living in a world that is toxic. And global warming is really just the fever of the planet. The reason really behind it, the root cause of this fever, is the toxicity that we have created.

Dr. Drew Sinatra: Yeah. And Dad, remember when I wrote that article for you, “Everyday Detox?” It was back in 2009.

Dr. Steve Sinatra: Yeah.

Dr. Drew Sinatra: The truth is, we have to be detoxing every single day. And Alejandro, that’s what I really like about your book. You’re not only giving the readers an elimination-type diet — where they’re going on this very, seven-day, clean, even liquid diet and really giving their digestive system a rest. You’re talking about herbs that help facilitate detoxification, you’re talking about sauna therapy, you’re talking about colonics, you’re talking about meditation, skin brushing — all the things that people need to be doing, really, on a daily or weekly basis to facilitate detoxification. So that’s what I love about your book, it’s comprehensive in all those things.

Dr. Alejandro Junger: Yeah, I agree with you 100%. In my book, I even say, the future of medicine should be no medicine. And the future of detoxification programs should be not detoxification programs. We should live a detoxification-supporting life, right? Not only within our organisms, but also with the planet.

Dr. Drew Sinatra: Yeah.

Dr. Steve Sinatra: Alejandro, you also mentioned non-alcoholic fatty liver disease, which I think is running wild in our society today. I think liver impairment…because liver is the primary organ of detoxification. Could you say a word or two about that?

Dr. Alejandro Junger: Yes. In the liver is where the chemical reactions mostly happen. They happen in other tissues too, but mostly is where the cytochrome P450 enzymes are, which take care of phase two detoxification — phase one is conjugation, sulfation, glucuronidation. All these chemical reactions that the liver cells are designed for, and where toxic molecules are converted to non-toxic through the steps, right? And then turn from liposoluble, which 90% of them are, and therefore cannot be eliminated into water-soluble. Now, what is the defense and adaptation mechanism most used by the body when it cannot catch up with the toxicity that we are exposed? Is the accumulation and generation of fat, because the fat will buffer the irritation of these molecules that are only fat-soluble. The body can detect that, and the body says, “Okay, I have all these toxic molecules there that I cannot eliminate through urine, feces, sweat, and breath, because they should be water-soluble to be able to do that.”

Dr. Alejandro Junger: So then what does the body do? Let’s buffer the irritation by generating and accumulating fat. Now, where are these toxins? A lot of them hanging around in the liver. So the liver is defending itself. Fatty liver is a defense mechanism, it’s not a disease. Most chronic diseases are really defense and adaptation mechanisms that are going on for too long. I mean, as a cardiologist, I was always wondering why plaque of cholesterol deposits in the arteries, right? Later on, I understood that it is the arteries that are getting irritated, fissured because of high blood pressure, smoking, diabetes, right? And those mini fissures, the body tries to patch so that the healing happens, under just very much like a scab is what the body does in order to allow healing to happen underneath.

Dr. Alejandro Junger: Now, when the healing happens, the scab falls. If the artery, if the insult would stop, the artery would deposit that plaque, heal the wall of the artery, and then that plaque would be reabsorbed. Now we know through the work of Dean Ornish and many others, that that is really what happens when you change the habit and you stop the insult. But most people don’t stop the insult, so the body continues to deposit the plaque, and eventually coronary artery disease is diagnosed. But it is nothing more than an adaptation and survival mechanism gone on for too long. And basically, you can summarize this by saying that the body is not born, is not designed by nature with information on how to generate disease. The only information we have, our cells function on, the software of our cells, is really just to adapt and survive. There is no information how to get sick, right? So these adaptation mechanisms are the way the body wisely responds to the circumstances and the conditions that we have created.

Dr. Steve Sinatra: And that’s why, and you said it beautifully, that detoxification now has to be something that we put in our everyday lives. And just the way like Drew said, whether it’s sauna, or whether it’s through diet, whatever it takes. We human beings need to focus on detoxification because again, it’s probably one of the greatest causes of illness today. Your story is so typical, it’s incredible.

Dr. Alejandro Junger: As we understand the different systems of the body, we understand how to support them. Body-builders really understand how to support muscle growth. So they eat and exercise in a certain way that that’s what they promote. And they support it, so they allow it to happen. And in the same way, so many organs and systems, we know what to do and support, and all this advice is out there. We need to learn how to support the detoxification system, as well. Which until now, in a mass consciousness understanding, is completely ignored.

Dr. Steve Sinatra: So Dr. Alejandro, if you had one “pearl” to give our listeners, just one insight into detoxification, what would that be?

Dr. Alejandro Junger: It’s a difficult question, as simple as it sounds, because there are so many aspects that are related, to choose one is very hard. But I’m going to go for it. The one thing that I think has the biggest impact, as I see and witness on people that I help, is the reduction of the workload of the digestive system. Now that entails a few different aspects, right? So for example, one of the things is not eating that much. Questioning this cultural, business construct that we came up with of breakfast, lunch, and dinner, and snacking in the middle. If you break that pattern alone, and one way to do it is through intermittent fasting. We know now there’s incredible benefits.

Dr. Alejandro Junger: Another aspect of not taxing the digestive system is really eating real foods — and not food-like products, right? So just with that, just understanding how to decrease the workload of the digestive system, I think, is one of the most impactful things we can do as a species, to improve our survival and chances of being around for longer.

Dr. Steve Sinatra: I agree, 100%. So well said, Alejandro, so well said. Drew, take it from here. That was a great summary.

Dr. Drew Sinatra: That’s a great summary, and I couldn’t agree more with the digestion piece. And I find, like what you mentioned in your book, too, the intermittent fasting is such an important element for people to bring into their daily practice. And for some, it can be challenging at first to do that. But Dad, I remember back in the day, this is early 2000s, you were intermittent fasting before it was even a thing.

Dr. Alejandro Junger: Your father has been talking of many things that were not even a thing when he started talking about them.

Dr. Drew Sinatra: Well, Alejandro, thank you so much for coming on the show today. This was great.

Dr. Alejandro Junger: Yeah, I really enjoy seeing a father and son working together. I hope my son works together with me one day.

Dr. Drew Sinatra: Oh, beautiful.

Dr. Drew Sinatra: That’s our show for today, folks. If you have a question or an idea for a show topic, please send us an email or share a post with us on Facebook. And remember, if you liked what you heard today and you want to be an active member of the Be HEALTHistic community, subscribe to our podcast at BeHEALTHisticPodcast.com, or on Apple Podcasts, or wherever you download your favorites. You can also find more great content and information from us and the Healthy Directions team at HealthyDirections.com.

Dr. Drew Sinatra: I’m Dr. Drew Sinatra.

Dr. Steve Sinatra: And I’m Dr. Steve Sinatra.

Dr. Drew Sinatra: And this is Be HEALTHistic.

Narrator: Thanks for listening to Be HEALTHistic, with Drs. Drew and Steve Sinatra, powered by our friends at Healthy Directions. See you next time.